Running Together: Family, Racing, and Resilience

Summary

In this episode of Ginger and Chocolate, co-hosts Mike Ergo and Lindsay Hiken discuss the importance of family, the benefits of spending time with loved ones, and share personal stories about running and racing. They explore how family interactions can boost self-esteem, reduce stress, and create lasting memories. The conversation also touches on the challenges of parenting, the supportive nature of the trail racing community, and the joy of shared experiences.

Keywords

family, running, racing, parenting, trail racing, self-esteem, stress reduction, community, shared experiences

Takeaways

• Family provides a safe space to talk openly about emotions.
• Positive interactions with loved ones release feel-good chemicals.
• Spending time with family boosts self-esteem and confidence.
• A nurturing family environment helps children feel safe and loved.
• Overcoming adversity as a family builds resilience.
• Shared experiences create lasting memories.
• The trail racing community is supportive and inclusive.
• Encouragement without expectations fosters genuine interest in activities.
• Creating your own family can provide similar benefits to biological family.
• Spending time with family promotes psychological wellness.

Sound bites

• Family provides a safe space.
• Positive interactions release feel-good chemicals.
• Boosts self-esteem and confidence.
• Helps children feel safe and loved.
• Builds resilience through adversity.
• Creates lasting memories.
• Trail racing community is supportive.
• Encouragement without expectations.
• Create your own family bonds.
• Promotes psychological wellness.

Thinking...

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Transcript

Mike Ergo (00:01.406)
Hey everybody, welcome back to Ginger and Chocolate. I'm your co-host Mike along with Lindsay, my co-host Lindsay. How are doing today?

Lindsay Hiken (00:10.382)
Well, other than being tired as usual, I'm doing pretty good. I had some weird dreams last night. dreamt that I apparently had gone into construction as my field and I was in Europe building this dome over like a house from the 1600s, like this glass dome to protect it. I have no idea what my subconscious is trying to say.

Mike Ergo (00:34.282)
Hahaha.

Yeah, that sounds like a fun one.

Lindsay Hiken (00:38.986)
Yeah, I'm gonna have to look up dream. know how you can people interpret dreams. I'm gonna have to look that up and see what it says.

Mike Ergo (00:46.878)
Yeah, I think some of that's maybe has some substance to it, but a lot of it, I don't know, just seems like, you know, crystal stuff like, is it? Is it? Is it really there or not? I don't know.

Lindsay Hiken (00:56.696)
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Lindsay Hiken (01:02.634)
it's total bullshit, but it's fun to look at it.

Mike Ergo (01:06.206)
Yes. Yes, I agree with that. I agree with you there.

Lindsay Hiken (01:12.352)
So how have you been? I haven't seen you in a little bit.

Mike Ergo (01:15.582)
Yeah, I was up in Alaska doing some fishing with some, some other guys I knew and, and met some other guys on the trip there. And, went up for about five days to Sitka, Alaska, and it's in the Southern part of the state. we stayed at a lodge, you know, they cooked for us every day and we went out on a boat for three days and went fishing for albacore tuna and then halibut the next day. And then,

salmon the third day and just really good, refreshing, restorative time and loved it. It was a absolutely great and came back with about 80 pounds of fish and two boxes. Yeah, they, they filleted and cleaned it and packaged it up for us. And now my three freezers are stuffed with it.

Lindsay Hiken (02:09.122)
So you will eat 80 pounds of fish.

Mike Ergo (02:12.486)
of yeah I'll give some away you know I've given some away to friends and family but yeah it'll last for a while

Lindsay Hiken (02:21.87)
I have a question about the you said three different kinds of fish on three different days. So do you go to different areas to find these fish? Okay, because I was like, how can you decide it's salmon day and be in the same place and only get that?

Mike Ergo (02:23.497)
Yeah.

Mike Ergo (02:31.336)
huh.

Mike Ergo (02:36.092)
Yeah, yeah, different water and you know, generally you follow like tuna is an offshore fish. So you go find the water temperature that's right for them and you see them on the surface and you start dropping your lines and go for them. And then yeah, halibut. They know the areas to go for. I don't know exactly how they find the salmon, but they seem to know where to go.

Lindsay Hiken (03:04.267)
Yeah, salmon. All right. Well, how is your training coming along for I know you got to give a marathon coming up?

Mike Ergo (03:13.308)
Yeah, yeah, I got one end of October. So it's kind of long. I slacks when I was out. I did not run in Alaska. It was raining and I wanted to sleep and I did not run up there. But this weekend as part of my train run, we are we my daughter and I went and did a trail 5k down in Marin County and it was awesome.

Lindsay Hiken (03:42.638)
That's so cute. So tell us a little bit about, do a little mini race recap with your daughter.

Mike Ergo (03:43.548)
It was so fun.

Mike Ergo (03:50.763)
Yeah. Yeah. So the race we did was the Sasquatch racing honey badger 5k. So they had a 5k 10k half and it was at China camp state park down in center fell really pretty. I'd never been there before. And yeah.

Lindsay Hiken (04:11.748)
I was going to say I have been there one time because the Marin triathlon you go through a China camp.

Mike Ergo (04:17.45)
cool. Yeah, it's a really pretty area. A lot of oak trees, rolling hills, and then you're right by the bay. So it's pretty area. So yeah, we went down there and yeah, I told my daughter beforehand. I said, look, you're going to be faster than me. So don't feel like you need to hang back with me. If you feel comfortable, just go race your race and

Lindsay Hiken (04:38.83)
Ha

Mike Ergo (04:44.49)
you know, the look of his directions and where to go on the trail. I'll be people pointing us the right way. So it goes fast. want so yeah, sure did. Yeah, sure did. She just absolutely smoked me. She looked back once and I said, keep going. You're good. And uh, yeah, she ended up getting sixth place overall in the whole race. She's a lot. Yeah, she's 11. So

Lindsay Hiken (04:53.418)
And did she?

Lindsay Hiken (05:10.4)
Wow.

Sixth place overall.

Mike Ergo (05:14.908)
Yeah, overall. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, it was a great, great run. She's really good. Notice how to pace. She said one guy passed her like the very end had like a final kick. But now she did great. It was it was so fun. Really proud. And it was a you know, was huffing and puffing come through it. You know, it's it's amazing.

Lindsay Hiken (05:16.982)
Wow, that's fast.

Lindsay Hiken (05:40.823)
Mike Ergo (05:44.756)
to me just remembering, yeah, this is the pace you run a 5k as opposed to, you know, a marathon, half marathon, et cetera.

Lindsay Hiken (05:51.746)
Hmm.

Yeah, absolutely. I'm actually reading a book called, I think it's called 80 20 running. It's by Matt Fitzgerald. Have you read that? Have you read that book or heard about 80 20 running?

Mike Ergo (06:04.564)
Mm-hmm.

Mike Ergo (06:10.651)
No, but I'm familiar with Matt Fitzgerald.

Lindsay Hiken (06:12.686)
Mm hmm. Highly recommend the book. It's because I'm getting back into running and so I'm reading some books about running. And as I try to, you know, I have a I created a running plan for me to get to my 10 K. And I wanted to try to figure out some ways to get my run back without getting injured.

Mike Ergo (06:27.059)
Mm-hmm.

Mike Ergo (06:36.286)
Yeah. Yeah.

Lindsay Hiken (06:38.03)
And in 80-20 running, the basic premise is that 80 % of your running is at a really slow pace. And apparently, this is what elite runners and pros are doing. They're running like in zone one, two for 80 % of their running. And then they do the other 20 % split between moderate. So zones like

Mike Ergo (06:48.798)
Yes.

Mike Ergo (07:00.83)
Mm-hmm.

Lindsay Hiken (07:07.48)
three, four, and then another, the other half of their 20 % is, you know, is at zone five, so at their max zone. And one thing he talks about is just in terms of figuring out what pace is, you know, because he does it by heart rate, by pace. And he talks about your 5K pace versus.

Mike Ergo (07:27.326)
Yeah.

Lindsay Hiken (07:31.919)
your half marathon marathon pace and how you do need to kind of figure out based on what race you're doing, like how much running you're doing and the sort of like, what is the upper limit that you need to hit based on your race? So I think that's interesting. I tend to just run whatever pace I can do that day, which is not really the best way of training.

Mike Ergo (07:40.584)
Yeah.

Mike Ergo (07:55.582)
Ha ha ha.

Lindsay Hiken (07:59.523)
And you know what else he said, which I thought was kind of interesting was that elite runners are better at doing 80-20 than your average just like, you know, your average runner who's just doing it for fun. He said that people who are just regular runners tend to do 50-50 or 60-40 of fast running because

Mike Ergo (08:15.402)
Mm-hmm.

Lindsay Hiken (08:29.55)
They find it hard to get down into zone one, because of the perception that they're worried about the perception of other people.

Mike Ergo (08:38.644)
That's, that's it. And then, you know, if, if you are slower, your slow is really slow, right? So it's, it, I, I'm, I'm not worried about the perception of other people when I'm running it, but what I'm running into is, especially at this fitness level where I'm not as high up as I was, you know, a few years back, my slow runs are just, it's really slow. So I'm fighting against,

Lindsay Hiken (08:44.803)
Right.

Mike Ergo (09:07.454)
My watch is beeping at me slow down even more. And it's it's, it's hard for me to run that slow and feel like I'm doing anything. So I get it. Yeah.

Lindsay Hiken (09:10.221)
Hmm.

Lindsay Hiken (09:16.142)
Mm hmm. I suffer from both, you know. I've had. I mean, I'm crazy, but I've had these periods, you know, where I'm running really because right now I'm in the same boat. I'm actually probably even a little worse because I'm just doing some run walks and I'm, you know, very slow. So it's hard for me to do 80 20 because I don't have zone. You know, three through five, I don't even have have that in my.

repertoire right now, but but I am running slow and I want to tell people who are running near me or past me like, I'm just starting again and I'm in zone one because I'm just starting. you know, instead of just being like they don't care and they don't, you know.

Mike Ergo (09:47.025)
huh.

Mike Ergo (09:58.557)
Yeah, right.

you know, I ran into a situation where I felt like I needed to explain myself. and it was because I was doing intervals, but it ha it was timed perfectly. I was, so I was running down the street, down the sidewalk and right as I'm starting to do an interval or about to this lady who's running, pops out of this trail and starts running the same way as me. And then I start my interval. So it looks like I'm trying to race her.

Lindsay Hiken (10:33.07)
Bye.

Mike Ergo (10:33.111)
right? And then I and then I stopped and she eventually catches catches me and goes past and then I am doing like running past really fast again. And I'm thinking in my head, you know, does she think I'm some kind of like competitive psychopath? I gotta beat her.

Lindsay Hiken (10:49.678)
But then I run out of steam and I gotta slow down again.

Mike Ergo (10:52.67)
And then and then I'm Yeah, exactly. Then I got to catch my breath. And it's a spathetic cycle. I because I felt the need to be like, I'm just doing intervals. I'm not trying to race you but I never never was at that spot. I just let it go. But it was

Lindsay Hiken (11:10.04)
Yes, I definitely know that. I'm working on right now just getting to 30 minutes of running without any walks, so no run walk without any pain. And then at that point, Matt Fitzgerald said, if you do 30 minutes of running straight, then you can start the 80-20.

Mike Ergo (11:23.306)
Mm-hmm.

Nice.

Lindsay Hiken (11:34.892)
you know, if you can be at that point. So I'm just kind of working, working my way up to that point, but I'm excited to be running again. Thank you. And what about try? Are you doing some some triathlon training? Are you doing some swimming and cycling right now?

Mike Ergo (11:40.702)
Yes, welcome back. Welcome back.

Mike Ergo (11:51.847)
I've gotten the bike a couple of times and I've been in the pool but I wouldn't say I've done anything consistent enough to call it training. yeah I'm just focused more on this marathon training and and sleeping so yeah.

Lindsay Hiken (12:09.006)
Sleep is good. We've done it a whole episode on sleep and how important it is. So it's good. You know, another thing I'll just talk about from this book is that is that he mentions cross training. So if you want to run less, you can do other endurance cross training. And so he talks about, you know, treadmill walking uphill. So if you want to

Mike Ergo (12:14.269)
Yeah.

Mike Ergo (12:36.176)
huh.

Lindsay Hiken (12:36.64)
So I don't have a treadmill. I need to go back to the gym, but you can put it on a high like uphill so you can walk on the treadmill uphill. Or he recommends cycling. And he said, you can cycle once a week and even just once a week and it will improve your running. So if you want to do, he said, you know, a lot of elite athletes are doing.

Mike Ergo (12:48.637)
Nice.

Lindsay Hiken (13:00.758)
like to 14 workouts a week because they're running in the morning and the afternoon, which I'm not going to do. But he said, let's say you're doing you want to do three to four days of running a week. You could do three to four days of cycling a week and it'll benefit your run. So I thought that was kind of cool.

Mike Ergo (13:04.936)
Wow, yeah. Uh-huh. Nope.

Mike Ergo (13:16.521)
Yeah.

Mike Ergo (13:19.988)
That is cool. Yeah, that is cool. I mean, it's definitely building your aerobic base. So, no, that's, that's great. I'm looking forward to getting back more into Zwift and, and, riding in my trainer. Yeah, not too many outdoor rides for me. I I've come to the conclusion that everybody on the road is texting and I have zero trust, but I'm okay right on the trainer.

Lindsay Hiken (13:25.87)
Mm-hmm.

Lindsay Hiken (13:43.31)
Mm-hmm.

And you had mentioned there's some anger and angst where you live with by people who are driving and that's a little scary.

Mike Ergo (13:53.092)
yeah.

Mike Ergo (13:58.257)
Yeah, I'm not trying to be part of that. And I like cycling. I don't love it. So I just have this idea of me getting hit doing something I don't totally love and be like, man, that wasn't even worth it.

Lindsay Hiken (14:03.98)
Mm-hmm.

Lindsay Hiken (14:13.462)
Right. There is that. This is why like doing my my gravel bike because I get off the road pretty quickly and then into the trails and, you know, fire roads. And there's just really no cars. I feel so much better. You have to look over your shoulder every five seconds to see if someone is coming up behind you. So.

Mike Ergo (14:22.27)
huh.

Mike Ergo (14:31.338)
That's great.

Yeah, that's perfect.

Lindsay Hiken (14:39.338)
OK, we're actually not even planning to talk about running and racing this today. Today we have another plan. But the last thing I'll say about this is I am doing the Woodside Ramble 10K on December 20th, and I'm doing the New Year's Day Brazen Racing Half Marathon.

And I recommend both of those races. I've done them both before and it's so fun, especially the New Year's Day one is amazing because all the people are out there early, bright and shiny and they're, you know, they're not hung over and they're not kicking off their year with like.

Mike Ergo (15:00.294)
Nice.

Mike Ergo (15:10.324)
Yeah.

Mike Ergo (15:17.46)
Yeah.

Lindsay Hiken (15:17.698)
just a massive pounding. So some girlfriends and I go do it and then we tailgate. So we all bring food and then we hang out our friends. Yeah, yeah, it's it's fun. It's really fun. So we're doing that. So you're definitely invited, Mike, if you want to come to either one of those. They do have a they do have a five K. So if you want to bring your fam, they do have a five K as well. Five K, 10 K.

Mike Ergo (15:26.641)
nice.

Mike Ergo (15:36.412)
Okay, I appreciate it.

Mike Ergo (15:41.707)
Yeah, it was so fun. When we finished, I explained to her how just kind of races work. Everyone's pretty chill at the Trail of Racing community and how it's nice and how you get your snacks and you finish your medal after. And then we took our pictures and we actually got to meet

former Olympian Shannon Robury who lives in San Francisco and she's a I think she's bronze medalist from London yeah and just incredible woman and so she she had a couple books she was selling there so she autographed one for my daughter and yeah good to meet her I think she was 1500

Lindsay Hiken (16:19.277)
Lindsay Hiken (16:28.511)
cool. Was she marathon runner or?

Mm-hmm. those people are so fast. I mean.

Mike Ergo (16:37.896)
Yeah. Yeah. So she, it was just really cool that she had talked to my daughter for a while about, you know, just, you know, setting goals and loving the sport and finding direction. And, and then her book she was selling was a workbook on how you can set your goals and, you know, work towards what you want to work to athletically.

Lindsay Hiken (16:45.294)
That's sweet.

Lindsay Hiken (17:03.112)
that's really cool. That's very, cool. Will you put the name? Let's put the name of that book in the show notes and we'll put also 80 to 80 20 running so people can can check those out. I'd like to check out her book. That sounds cool. So speaking of family, our topic for today is actually about family and the benefits of spending time with family. Now, I have a number of friends who are sober and

Mike Ergo (17:04.681)
Uh-huh.

Mike Ergo (17:09.417)
Yeah.

Mike Ergo (17:14.719)
Yeah.

Lindsay Hiken (17:33.187)
they come from very toxic family environments. it's sad because what we're gonna talk about, the benefits of family doesn't really apply to them. if you have a toxic family environment, we are not suggesting by any means that you put yourself in into that. And of course we all have things with our family, but there are some benefits to spending time with family and...

Mike Ergo (17:36.639)
Mm-hmm.

Mike Ergo (17:56.179)
Yeah.

Mike Ergo (18:02.142)
Well, I'll say this before you get into it is that, you know, if your biological family is an ideal, you can make your family and you can make it close friends and people around you you spend time with. And I believe you can get some of the same benefits that we're talking about today.

Lindsay Hiken (18:20.566)
Absolutely, that's a really good point. That's a really good point. can create your own family. And I've heard that in the rooms of 12 step, know, that there people are like, this is my family now because I don't have I don't have a family. the number one thing that I said about why it's good to spend time with your family is the emotional and mental health benefits and that.

It reduces stress and anxiety. know, family provides a safe place to talk openly about emotions and problems, which can act as a buffer against stress. positive interactions with loved ones release feel good chemicals like dopamine and oxytocin. And so I feel like creating that safe family environment.

which you do for your kids and I do for my kids is the key to that piece.

Mike Ergo (19:17.556)
Yeah, yeah. Yes.

Lindsay Hiken (19:22.702)
Oh, and here's another one. Spending time with your family boosts self-esteem and confidence. So feeling loved and valued by your family creates a positive self-image, which is a protective factor against issues like depression and anxiety. So, yeah.

Mike Ergo (19:41.065)
Yeah, it's a nice, I think, change of pace too. Anytime you can get outside the normal hustle and bustle of daily life and do something like a race, you're in a different setting. It's just you reframe the relationship and you reframe just your interactions and just have a fun time. My daughter and I talking about it. She's like, well,

What's it like when you do races and what's your favorite part or what do you get nervous about? And, you know, so I could share some of those things I've done. And I told her, hey, you know, the benefit of the races like this, you know, it's 5K, 10K half marathon is that unlike the world of Ironman, you have the rest of your day to do whatever you want.

Lindsay Hiken (20:19.843)
Mm-hmm.

Lindsay Hiken (20:34.766)
Mm hmm. That is true. Definitely some of us do not have the rest of the day doing an Iron Man. It's like it's all day all day. You know, I think I've talked about this on the show before, but I'm not sure. And if I did, it was a long time ago. I did the rock and roll half marathon with my daughter. Yeah, yeah, we did the 10 K and then we did the.

Mike Ergo (20:47.338)
of the day.

Mike Ergo (20:58.901)
nice.

Lindsay Hiken (21:04.426)
the half and the 10K one year and a half the next year. And the training piece was really, really fun. We trained together a little bit. I'll say she didn't train as much as I recommended. She was really into her boyfriend who's now her husband. So I guess that's legit. Yeah, it did.

Mike Ergo (21:20.531)
Mm-hmm. Yeah.

Mike Ergo (21:26.59)
Worked out.

Lindsay Hiken (21:29.674)
And but one day I took her on a trail that it's about like six and a half mile loop that I like. And I said, OK, let's let's just go train there. And then Josh came with us and he kept running ahead and hiding in the bushes.

Mike Ergo (21:39.002)
huh.

Mike Ergo (21:47.781)
Hahaha

Lindsay Hiken (21:48.013)
And then he would he would jump out of us. And Jillian was like, this is my idea of hell. Just first of all, she was like, I'm not trained enough. And then he's like, out of the bush.

But when we were on the course running together, it was such an amazing thing. And this is a child who I didn't see for a while because of my disease and the divorce and I was drinking a lot and I didn't see her. And so that feeling of like, we're just running together. The rock and roll half is at night. So you run down the strip at night. Yeah, it was really cool.

Mike Ergo (22:28.112)
cool.

Lindsay Hiken (22:32.706)
We chatted a little, we also had these moments of just silence where I could just hear her breath and my breath together. And it really solidified that sort of feeling of family and the bond between a parent and a child. And then we got towards.

She we got to the last mile. So we are mile 12 and she's like, my God, I can't believe I made it. And I'm like, we have one more mile and she's like, I'm going to cry. I'm like, don't cry yet. We still have that last month. Don't cry yet. And so we spent the last mile with her being like now. And I'm like, no, not yet. Not yet. Because I didn't want her to. I said, when you see the carpet, you know, when we hit the carpet, so we hit the carpet. She's like, I can't believe I did it.

Mike Ergo (23:03.973)
Hehehehehe

Mike Ergo (23:13.236)
Don't cry quite yet. Yeah.

Lindsay Hiken (23:23.208)
and gave me the biggest hug at the end. And it was such a special moment for us. It was just such a healing moment for us, having had that sort of broken relationship that we had. know, she didn't know me when she was little and I was I was checked out. And so I had to do a lot of work. We had to do a lot of work to. Form this relationship, but it's talking about here, you know, making a safe space and providing a sense of belonging.

Mike Ergo (23:29.523)
Yes.

Mike Ergo (23:34.761)
Mmm.

Yeah.

Lindsay Hiken (23:53.487)
It took a minute for me to get that once I sobered up. What else do we have? okay. So spending time with family promotes psychological wellness. says research shows that people who spend more time with family and friends have a greater sense of purpose and find life more meaningful.

Mike Ergo (23:56.82)
Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Mike Ergo (24:17.759)
Yeah.

Lindsay Hiken (24:19.278)
Do you, I was thinking about you spending time with your veteran friends and if you feel that.

Mike Ergo (24:26.826)
It's what we have in common, a lot of us are dads and a lot of us have daughters. And so we talked about what it means to raise daughters and be good examples as men.

how raising daughters is different than raising sons. So we had a lot of chat about that. And then, you know, so it felt like a renewed my sense of, of being a good dad and commitment to that. So it was, it was perfect. And it was a nice little break from the normal hustle and bustle of work and everything else.

Lindsay Hiken (25:06.537)
That's it.

Lindsay Hiken (25:12.302)
Mm hmm. Mm hmm. Yes, definitely. Anytime I can get a little vacation, a little separation from where I live, it's good for me mentally and emotionally for sure.

Mike Ergo (25:23.593)
Yeah.

Lindsay Hiken (25:26.318)
So this is something, benefits for children's development. So there's benefits, obviously, for children. But a nurturing family environment helps children feel safe and loved, which is sort of a no-brainer. But at the same time, I think that that's hard for some parents. Some parents have.

Mike Ergo (25:49.4)
huh.

Lindsay Hiken (25:51.257)
challenges with that. And if you can build that safe, excuse me, and loved environment, it's a foundation for healthy emotional development. And it will foster positive behavior in our children and reduce risky behaviors, which is what I think is important.

Mike Ergo (26:03.156)
Yeah.

Mike Ergo (26:06.44)
Yeah.

Lindsay Hiken (26:14.774)
especially as children of people who have alcohol or addiction issues, we want them to not have those same issues. And so what we can do to help support keeping them from risky behavior, not that we can completely wrap them in bubble wrap like I'd like to do, but.

Mike Ergo (26:16.319)
Yeah.

Mike Ergo (26:26.365)
Mm-hmm.

Mike Ergo (26:30.186)
Right.

Mike Ergo (26:38.43)
Yeah. Yeah, no, I get it. You set them up for success, having fun in those kind of environments. And especially, you know, if they get a taste of success or just get a taste of enjoying it and being included in that environment, then they feel great. And that's I mean, I had a couple of experiences like that as a kid that really stuck with me and

hope my, daughter does too. And, and, and also I was thinking, I was going to say, this is the first time we raced together, but we actually did a race. I, it was probably maybe five or six years ago. We did a Turkey truck down in San Diego. And I just remember that, we're all set to do it and she's all ready. And then it started in all this massive people were running.

Lindsay Hiken (27:21.27)
All right.

Lindsay Hiken (27:33.634)
Mm-hmm.

Mike Ergo (27:33.681)
around us and she got really overwhelmed and started crying. So we just kind of stopped and took a break and I was like, do you want to quit? You want to, you want to be done? We don't have to do this. And she just kind of looked at me and then just started walking and we walked the whole 5k and it was, we were the last people to finish. They're starting to pack things up. It's like my nightmare scenario for an iron man. I was like the finish line is being packed up and like no one's there.

Lindsay Hiken (27:48.046)
Hmm?

Lindsay Hiken (27:51.564)
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Lindsay Hiken (28:02.272)
Hmm

Mike Ergo (28:04.596)
but we finished and, she crossed the finish line before me. was like, go, go, go run the last part. And she did. And then they were looking around for a finishers medal. And I just remember the people, all the people were gone except for the two people like packing it up and the, the one, the one guy goes, yeah, we have that one. We have that one metal left that that lady dropped in the water and

Lindsay Hiken (28:19.446)
Alright.

Lindsay Hiken (28:30.348)
Yeah

Mike Ergo (28:31.55)
So they had one finisher medal left over for her. So it was perfect. She got a medal. We finished the race. yeah, yeah, it was good.

Lindsay Hiken (28:36.878)
That's cute. That's really cute. Total aside, not about family, but it is rough when you're finishing. Late, you know what I mean? Iron Man was like Iron Man, Santa Rosa was like, there's no food left by the time I got it, which was fine. I didn't really feel like eating anyway, but it was kind of like it was kind of over with, you know, by the time I rolled out, rolled, rolled out there and.

Mike Ergo (28:47.742)
Mike Ergo (28:54.015)
Ugh.

Mike Ergo (29:03.231)
Yeah.

Lindsay Hiken (29:07.202)
I was also kind of like, guys, you know there's going to be a bunch of us because I was not last, right? You I'm like, you should have a second wave of food for people who like, walk running the run, basically. They didn't do that, but whatever. And then the other thing I'll say about finishing like kind of late is that my good friend, Allie, who I ride with all the time and just adore her,

Mike Ergo (29:13.044)
Uh-huh. Yeah.

Mike Ergo (29:21.734)
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Lindsay Hiken (29:36.342)
It's much faster now than she used to be. And I did a century ride with her in Tahoe. And we were.

bringing up the rear. And so every time we got to an aid station, they were there, but they were kind of just waiting for us, you know what I mean? And once we rolled in, they were like packing it up. They're like, okay, what do you need? Because we want to get the fuck out of here. And we'd get our little stuff. And then I realized there was like three guys behind us.

Mike Ergo (29:47.166)
Yeah.

Mike Ergo (30:01.471)
Yeah.

Lindsay Hiken (30:10.102)
little gang of guys. They look kind of like, I think they were Korean and they look like kind of like businessmen who had rented bikes, you know what I mean? They definitely weren't like comfortable and they were behind us and they weren't very far behind us and I just remember being like, Ali, pedal, like we can't be last, let's not be last, just stay ahead of these dudes. And so we, they kept, they kept us in their sights, but we out pedaled them. So we were pretty happy about that, but.

Mike Ergo (30:17.107)
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Mike Ergo (30:36.49)
Hahaha.

Lindsay Hiken (30:38.35)
We got to the end at Squaw and it was sort of that deal where there was like nothing left. People just thought we were just riding our bikes, you know what I mean? And in that amount of time, Josh did the 100 miles, got in his car and drove back to the Bay Area. Literally, and I was like, we just finished and he was like, I'm sitting on my couch eating a burrito from Whole Foods. Like, okay.

Mike Ergo (30:46.419)
yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly.

Mike Ergo (31:04.134)
nice that's that's insane right

Lindsay Hiken (31:07.534)
Mm hmm, different experience. Let's see here. Creates lasting memories. We're kind of talking about that. Let's see. here's here's the I think a good one we could talk about the kind of the last thing we could bring up is that spending time with family builds resilience. So when a family faces challenges together, they learn to adapt and overcome adversity, emerging stronger as a unit.

Mike Ergo (31:13.918)
Mm-hmm.

Lindsay Hiken (31:35.086)
And so even simple everyday activities like having dinner together, going for a walk, playing a game can make a significant difference. The key is to be present and engage with one another, creating a foundation of love, trust and support that lasts a lifetime. I love the idea of overcoming adversity as a unit.

Mike Ergo (31:53.259)
Mm hmm. Yeah, I like that too. You know, facing things together, realizing you can rely on each other. And I think that overcoming adversity to plays into, you know, there's such a microcosm of that going on in a race, because you're overcoming the adversity of wanting to stop or slow down. And you're pushing yourself. You're really going for it. So

Lindsay Hiken (31:58.478)
Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

Lindsay Hiken (32:19.198)
Mm hmm. Yeah, I think we're in a very challenging time in America. And I know that there's anxiety amongst a lot of people and my daughter and my son both have a lot of anxiety about the current state of affairs. And

Mike Ergo (32:29.406)
Mm-hmm.

Mike Ergo (32:43.038)
Yeah.

Lindsay Hiken (32:45.356)
So my daughter lives near me. So I text with my son and stuff like that, but my daughter lives near me. And so being able to spend time together and bond and help her get through the anxiety, because sometimes it's overwhelming to her. And that has created a strong bond between us, just being able to sort of.

you know, she's called me crying and I've been able to just talk her through it or go see her. I mean, she has a whole husband in her house, but she's like, he doesn't get it the way she, you know I mean? She wants her mom, which is lovely.

Mike Ergo (33:20.17)
Yeah, yeah, yeah. I think that happens with with a lot of families. You know, I'll say shout out to the trail racing community, especially for I think, especially in these times where things are really difficult and unsure, and people aren't are facing a lot of anxiety and unknown. That experience just renewed my sense of seeing other people happy.

happy to see each other, accepting. We had all kinds of people there, you all different backgrounds and body shapes and, and ages and everyone was just kind to each other. You know, just like we know the trail racing community is and just having that experience kind of gave me a refresh of, okay. You know, there's a lot going on in the world, but also there's good. There's a lot of good.

Lindsay Hiken (34:02.967)
Yes.

Lindsay Hiken (34:16.382)
Right. Mm hmm. Yes, I agree. There is a lot of good and the trail racing community has always been such an open, loving community. mean, it's definitely.

Mike Ergo (34:17.66)
and we're doing it right here.

Lindsay Hiken (34:33.388)
I don't feel like, you know, at the beginning of the race, everyone's and everyone wants everybody else to succeed in whatever that looks like. Do know what I mean? Like if that looks like walking the whole thing, great. If it looks like running at an elite level, great. mean, everybody wants everybody to succeed. And I find people are generally very, very friendly on the on the trails, you know. And.

Mike Ergo (34:39.324)
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Mike Ergo (34:54.248)
Yeah, I mean, we literally had a guy in a Sasquatch costume doing warm ups for the race before we started. So how seriously can you take it? Right? It was great.

Lindsay Hiken (34:59.534)
Exactly. Yeah, I've had I'm not great running downhill. I'm not if it's steep, you know, I'm not very fast going downhill and and I've had races where actually at one of the brazen races I did New Year's Day, it was part of it goes

Mike Ergo (35:13.738)
Same.

Lindsay Hiken (35:28.94)
I did the 10K that year and part of it just goes straight up this hill and I beat this woman. She and I are kind of going back and forth with each other. I had some run fitness at the time and I beat her going up the hill. And. But she kicked my ass going downhill, you know what I mean? And it flattens out, but she was so far ahead of me. mean, I was running as hard as I could back, you know, and I never did catch her and.

Mike Ergo (35:46.045)
Hahaha, yeah.

Lindsay Hiken (35:57.903)
She was standing at the end waiting for me, which my initial interpretation, I was going down the shoot. was like, you bitch just sitting there waiting for me. But actually, she was super nice. And she was like, hey, good race and just chatty and very friendly. And I was like, oh, she's not she's not here to rub it in my face. I mean, she did win. So it's easy to be she she beat me. So it was easy to be friendly, I guess. But she just had that.

Mike Ergo (36:00.671)
Nice.

Mike Ergo (36:17.31)
To gloat.

Yeah.

Lindsay Hiken (36:27.394)
that trail community vibe of like, that was a great race, you know, and I did a good job because I was running against you and it was really fun. And, so I appreciate that. And I'm looking forward to spending more time with the trail community. And I'm looking forward to spending time with my kids. My daughter and I have decided to do a once a month brunch. Yeah, she's, I said, her, you want to do another race after we did the

Mike Ergo (36:42.772)
Yeah.

Mike Ergo (36:50.778)
good.

Lindsay Hiken (36:57.612)
half, She said, no, I did that to spend time with you. I'm, I don't like it.

Mike Ergo (36:57.694)
Mm-hmm.

Mike Ergo (37:04.49)
There's a check in the box and a good one you guys will always have that memory that's perfect

Lindsay Hiken (37:10.676)
Mm Yeah. And so now we do fancy brunch and we get dressed up and we go somewhere nice and we eat and we chat. Just which is. hmm. Yeah. Yeah. Any last thoughts on family or.

Mike Ergo (37:17.544)
That sounds wonderful.

Yeah.

Mike Ergo (37:25.29)
Well, um, I'm just looking forward to doing this more with, uh, my little one and, uh, watching her just excel at this and, and have fun and encourage her on and, and get to kind of watch from the back as I'm getting left in the dust. You know, I told her it was like, you're going to run faster than me. Just go for it. You know, just go for it. She, she definitely did. And it's, it's, it's fun because, know, I spent a long time with my son because we're both

Lindsay Hiken (37:41.262)
Mm-hmm.

Lindsay Hiken (37:45.624)
That's so cute.

That's awesome.

Mike Ergo (37:54.219)
We have the we're both guys. I know how to raise a boy more I know I know how to Coach him in baseball and do all the boys stuff. And so this is a fun thing I can have my daughter You know where we have this together. This is our thing. So She's she already said dad. Are we gonna do a marathon someday? I'm like, yes

Lindsay Hiken (38:06.626)
Mm-hmm.

That's awesome.

Lindsay Hiken (38:14.548)
Absolutely.

Mike Ergo (38:17.268)
So.

Lindsay Hiken (38:18.094)
I like the fact that it sounds like you're not going, she's fast and I'm going to immediately get her into coaching and be one of those parents that's trying to do. I like that. mean.

Mike Ergo (38:27.127)
Hahaha.

Mike Ergo (38:32.874)
Yeah, I'm trying to take the stance of encouragement, but not expectations. You know, so if she asked me about wanting to do like a coaching thing or get more into it, sure, I'll encourage that. But I do the same thing with I do with my son with baseball. It's like, is it still fun? It's still something you want to do? Okay, we can, we can work hard at it. But I want to make sure it's something you're doing because you love it. And

Lindsay Hiken (38:41.4)
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Lindsay Hiken (39:02.03)
Right.

Mike Ergo (39:03.176)
not something that I'm trying to vicariously live through you and force my dreams upon your childhood.

Lindsay Hiken (39:10.382)
Right. Which whenever I see that I feel, I feel a little bit sad. You know, I, I coach soccer a long time ago. I coached the U 19 soccer team, boys soccer team in, in a Mountain View, which sounds weird, but a friend of mine knew I played soccer previously and she had played at UCSB and she needed someone to co-coach.

Mike Ergo (39:17.576)
Yes, me too.

Mike Ergo (39:39.902)
Uh-huh.

Lindsay Hiken (39:40.245)
A Y.S.O. And. There were a couple of kids there that also played the CYSA, the more elite, you know. League, the AYSA was sort of like their warm up for the season, and there were definitely some parents who were like hell bent on their kids getting soccer scholarships and stuff, and it was it was rough to see, you know, a dad going off on his.

Mike Ergo (39:55.018)
Mike Ergo (39:58.697)
Yeah.

Mike Ergo (40:02.589)
Oof.

Lindsay Hiken (40:09.454)
17 year old about his, you know, we would try to soften that by being like, he did really good, the team relied on him, he'd, you know, and try to kind of talk the parent down a little bit. But man, not a fun experience for the kid.

Mike Ergo (40:10.14)
Mm-hmm.

Mike Ergo (40:23.688)
Yeah. No, I personally have zero patience for overbearing parents when it comes to sports, especially, but that's a fun topic for another episode. Yeah, we could.

Lindsay Hiken (40:33.742)
Absolutely, we could talk about that for an hour. All right, folks, well, I think that's it for this week. Yeah, if you could do one thing to help the show, it would be to share it with a friend and or rate and review. We like a five star rating for obvious reasons, but.

Be honest and write us however you feel is fair. Because all of that helps us promote the show to other people who might enjoy it. And with that, we will see you next week. Bye.

Mike Ergo (41:07.868)
Alright, see y'all.